Newsflash from the New York Times on the town hall spectacles we witnessed in August:
For all the shouting that has dominated these town hall meetings on health care lately, they have yielded a few important insights. The first is that the town hall itself has probably reached the end of its usefulness in the Internet age; if you’re looking for thoughtful dialogue, you might as well hold your next meeting on the stern of a Somali pirate ship. The second is that we now have a visual sense of the kind of voter who is militantly opposed to Obama’s health care agenda and, more broadly, to the president himself.
The typical anti-Obama activist tends to be white, male and — perhaps most significant — advanced in age.
The most vocal folks at the town halls did not look like youngest, most diverse generation that supports health insurance reform by wide margins.
If you missed the fun, there is still a chance to get visible and have your voice heard as Congress gets back to work next week. Join one of the many health care rallies across the country and send Congress back to Washington, D.C. with the message of reform ringing in their ears. Click here to sign up! Shouting, cool t-shirts, and signs are encouraged.
~Thomas, Rock the Vote
Tags: health care, town halls
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Thomas Bates Bio: Thomas is Rock the Vote's Vice President of Civic Engagement. @BatesThomas Email the author at: blog(at)rockthevote.com |
I thought the purpose of “Rock the Vote” was to encourage people that their voice does, in fact, matter. To encourage people to find a candidate they personally support. To encourage people to get out and vote.
That is not what I see in this article.
I see anti-white racism. I see one-sided thinking. I see a push for one particular agenda.
This is NOT what America is about and I am ashamed that Rock-the-Vote would publish this article.
OLD WHITE DUDE IS OLD AND WHITE
“anti-white racism”? I’d laugh if this weren’t so thoughtless and so pathetic. What part of “health care for EVERYBODY” excludes any race or color, J?
For your information, I am a Caucasian with two master’s degrees who has a life-threatening illness and, as of tomorrow, does not have health insurance because I lost my job. Think before you write, J… if you’re capable of rational thought, that is.
Classic identity politics. No need to listen to the old white guys. Their opinions don’t count because they don’t look like you. It was not too long ago that we believed that it was not the color of your skin (or how wrinkled it is) that matters, but the content of your character.
I think J’s post is right on. The author is suggesting that we need not listen to what health care protesters are saying because of what they look like. This is a very typical tactic when your arguments are not very strong. The personal attacks contained in Sandy’s post are also a common tactic when one’s argument is weak.
Sandy, then explain the point of identifying (purely through observation and not scientific polling) those against the plan are: “activist tends to be white, male and — perhaps most significant — advanced in age.”
For the sake of argument we’ll skip “activist”, but what in the above description doesn’t try to state that only angry old white men are responsible for causing an uproar? What does that observation, unsupported by facts, add to the story if not to make the reader jump to some arbitrary conclusion that the writer wishes to extol.
Why are you guys here? Are you members? Did you feel like rocking your vote? Do you rock anything? It sounds like you just came to whine. If you don’t like health care, call your Congressman or your mom or something. If you don’t like it that I think there should be more brown people in government, go hork lugies on your own blog.
I mean, I don’t go to Ayn Randworld or wherever you people came from and whine about how Objectivism is basically a religion for conceited people, or that libertarians should stick to their fortified mountain cabins.
Actually, if you will re-read my post, I didn’t say anything regarding health care. For that matter, I didn’t say anything about any issue.
What I said was that deciding that a person, or group of people, is wrong based solely on the color of their skin is racist. In this case, the author stated that we should not listen to the opinions of “old white people.”
If we are truly going to have a “color blind” world, then we must all live a color blind life. That goes for everyone – of every color.
Now if you want to discuss the health care bill, go download the 1,018 pages, read it, and tell me why (or why not) it should be passed. Let’s have a civil debate on the merits of the issue and leave race hatred out of the picture.
J
color blind does not mean that you get the microphone
color blind does not mean you set the terms of the discussion
color blind does not mean your right-wing talking points suddenly become brilliant
the reason old white guys are screaming like babies in town halls and that you are all omg wtf readthebill lol is that you honestly think that you can dupe the rest of us into thinking you are reasonable or give a crap about us or about people who are sick.
I already know that you don’t. I’m not blind.
plznim:
The fact of the matter is that you do not know who I am. You do not know what color I am. Mostly, you do not not know what I think about healthcare.
My point of this exchange, my only point, was that people should leave race hate out of the discussion. Race hate has no place in a civilized society.
Now on to healthcare…
Give me some well researched and documented reasons why you believe the healthcare bill should pass.(I can tell from you posts that you do think it should pass.) I would like for someone else to give me some well researched and documented reasons why it should fail. Then we can have a legitimate, civilized debate.
Armed with real facts, we can then, and only then, be capable of making an informed and rational decision.
J
J:
You are white. I can tell because you give rules like the bad kind of white person. “We cannot have a debate until you read…” “Give me some well researched…” “…only then…”
How long before poor kids get health care? While you sneer and preen, people are dying. Give me one good reason why I shouldn’t call you a rich, greedy, old, noseintheair white dink. It has to be well researched! Because I’ve been listening to your self-serving crap my whole life.
pointing out racial injustice is not race hate
you didn’t read the bill either
you’re running around giving rules like you’re the school principal
look up your own information and make up your own choice
man why won’t my comments display
I am a middle age, white, gay woman small business owner. We DO NOT NEED government run/mandated health care. There is not a government sponsored entity that is not poorly run and hemorrhaging money….Post Office, Social Security, Medicaid, Medicare, Public Schools….we have over 100 TRILLION in unfunded obligations right now which is threatening our financial freedom; without financial freedom there exist no other freedoms.
What do we need?: The ability as small businesses to buy insurance for our employees outside of our states (read more competition, right now the “government” will not let us do this), the ability to band together with other small businesses to create larger groups to reduce costs, we need different types of policies for individuals (healthy young people should be able to buy low cost catastrophic insurance etc)one size does not fit all; we need long term (multiple year health insurance similar to life insurance) instead of one year only policies this too will help manage costs; we need portable health insurance for individuals so if a job is lost they can maintain their health policy with the help of unemployment funds and of course we desperately need tort reform……there are many other simple no cost or very low cost things that can be done immediately without bankrupting the country and forcing punitive taxes on businesses and individuals.
Tell me something….why is it if the obama plan was passed today and is soooo very important that it does not take effect (except for the taxes) until 2012?? The simple things (except tort reform) I listed above will IMMEDIATELY reduce the cost of health care and are backed by 90% of the population…why not take these actions now???
So let me review the discussion thus far…
1.) The only people who would dare question the establishment, “tends to be white, male and — perhaps most significant — advanced in age.” And this is not a racial stereotype?
2.) “If you don’t like it that I think there should be more brown people in government, go hork lugies.” Actually, the argument was that race has no place in the discussion. The point is health care and how we might be able to improve the system.
3.) “Libertarians should stick to their fortified mountain cabins.” Really? All of them? All libertarians are gun-toting, militant, thugs, with mountain fortresses? Wow! And that is not a predjudice sterotype?
4.) I said, “What I said was that deciding that a person, or group of people, is wrong based solely on the color of their skin is racist. In this case, the author stated that we should not listen to the opinions of “old white people.” For that you call me an, “a rich, greedy, old, noseintheair white dink.” So because I am against racism, in any form, you attempt to insult me with a racial slur?
5.) I say we should “make informed decisions” and “research our for ourselves” and “participate in civilized debate.” And that makes me a, “bad kind of white person.” Really? How is being fully informed and making our own decisions a bad thing?
6.) You said, “you didn’t read the bill either.” Based on what would you make such an assumption? Actually, I am in the process of reading it. It takes a while. It is 1,018 pages.
Now…
Yes! I would like to see healthcare be more affordable for everyone.
Yes! I think government reform should eliminate the ban on purchasing health insurance from outside your own state.
Yes! I think government reform should eliminate the ban on groups of people purchasing group health pans so people will be able to unite and demand better pricing.
Yes! I think government reform should include Tort Reform that will reduce the number of frivolous lawsuits, thus reducing the cost of health care.
Perhaps you can tell from where this quote comes, “When the architects of our republic wrote the magnificent words of the Constitution and the Declaration of Independence, they were signing a promissory note to which every American was to fall heir. This note was a promise that all men, yes, black men as well as white men, would be guaranteed the ‘unalienable Rights’ of ‘Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.’”
I was about to point out that racial stereotyping only reveals the ignorance of the speaker, but then piznim made the point for me.
waaaambulance! somebody call the waaaaaambulance!
if I tell you that brown people didn’t get to vote in St. Louis and Kansas City and Hot Springs and Little Rock in 2000 AND 2004, I’m racial stereotyping
f I tell you that white people use more public services per capita (I am not kidding, farm subsidies are some major bank), have higher paying government jobs, and are waaaay overrepresented according ot population, I’m being a racist
You quote King at me and you are a freaking hypocrite. where have your dreams been denied? who’s stepping on your rights? rock the vote?
you’re just tripping off power and trying to deny help to the poor. what do you even get out of all this? i didn’t see you people whining when bush bankrupted the country cutting taxes and killing arabs
“6.) You said, “you didn’t read the bill either.” Based on what would you make such an assumption? Actually, I am in the process of reading it. It takes a while. It is 1,018 pages.”
in my school that counts as ‘not having read that thing’. And dink isn’t a racial slur, you dink
“[W]here have your dreams been denied? who’s stepping on your rights?”
“The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized. “
(United States Constitution – 4th Amendment)
How about this right? Denied! Page 58 of the health care bill (HR 3200).
———
“… certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty …”
(Declaration of Independence)
How about this right? Denied! Page 457!
———
Or perhaps you can explain to me why it is illegal to buy health insurance outside my home state? Don’t you think that violates my rights under Article I, Section 8 of the Constitution?
“[The Congress shall have power] To regulate commerce with foreign nations, and among the several states, and with the Indian tribes; “ (United State Constitution – Article 1, Section
———
Or maybe you can explain to my why I can get health insurance through my labor union or my credit union, or through a co-op, or just by getting a bunch of people together and getting a group policy? That is illegal. And it denies my right to unite with my fellow Americans to demand better pricing.
“Although it is not expressly protected in the First Amendment, the Supreme Court ruled, in NAACP v. Alabama, 357 U.S. 449 (1958), freedom of association to be a fundamental right protected by it. In Boy Scouts of America v. Dale, 530 U.S. 640 (2000), the Supreme Court ruled that a New Jersey law, which forced the Boy Scouts of America to admit an openly gay member, to be an unconstitutional abridgment of the Boy Scouts’ right to free association.” (Wikipedia)
So I can associate with any group of my choice just so long as that association doesn’t have the side-effect of getting lower health insurance rates. That just doesn’t make sense. Government regulation, in this case, is artificially raising health insurance costs.
———
So, yes, my rights are being trampled upon. Your rights are being trampled upon. The rights of Americans everywhere are being trampled upon. So I really don’t care that you hate me because I am white. I want a system that will work better for everyone and I am willing to work hard to get it.
For the record that
was supposed to be an 8 followed by an ).
i don’t hate you b/c you’re white. i’m white. I hate you because you’re a tool and a whiner and after sitting through eight years of bush basically slapping America in the face, when someone finally tries to make a change and help us help each other, you jump in the waaaaambulance and start citing page numbers from a house bill, which pretty much shows this is the first house bill youve ever read in your life. (try using the title/subtitle/section structure that’s actually in the bill instead of the way Adobe Acrobat divides the page numbers, brainiac)
your rights? in Texas they executed an innocent black man this month. His name was Cameron Todd Willingham, look it up
your rights? 11 million children are uninsured and I don’t see you lifting a goddamn finger, but then you wouldn’t because you don’t give a flying one about a hispanic kid that went deaf in one ear because his parents make too much to get medicaid and too little to pay to treat his ear infection. you just don’t care. nothing you say indicates that you are willing to do even a little tiny thing or make a tiny little sacrifice for your fellow human. you’re a freaking speed bump in the way to a better world.
your rights? we insure the people in this country who sit at desks and shuffle papers, and leave people with callouses and backaches and 39 hour workweeks out in the cold (if you don’t know what it means to get 39 hours, you should be ashamed of yourself). you are all ‘read 1018 pages’ and i’m like sorry I gotta go serve fajitas to jerkoffs that think they’re better than everyone else because they sit in an office and misread house bills
go hang, man. your outrage is weak sauce
Let me see if I get this straight, piznim. Someone spends their day working “at a desk”, then frequents a place where you work, spends his hard earned money at the establishment you work at, and your problem is with the guy who helping to supply your wage?
Would you rather he kept his money, and not went to your the place where you serve fajitas? Then you can sit at home unemployed (cause who needs fajitas servers if no one is spending their money) and complain about how the “desk worker” didn’t just give his whole damn paycheck to you.
Piznim, just one more thing…If you are upset about 40 hours-a-week being full-time, you have a gripe with FDR (someone Obama has heavily praised.) You see Piznim, thanks to FDR, in 1938 the Fair Labor Standards Act was passed. This set the work week at 40 hours, and requires that employers pay employees overtime for any hours worked over 40 hours. So the government, in all of its infinite wisdom, incentivized employers to give you less than 40 hours-a-week.
So if you have a gripe, it isn’t with the “desk guy”, or even your employer, it is with the government who essentially mandates that your employer not employ you too much. Yes, let’s please give the government more power.
adam you eat because people dig in dirt for you
im in the service industry i get it im expendable
but i’m nowhere near as bad off as the absolutely most important people in america
farmers construction workers (i mean the real ones, the undocumented immingrants) trash gas company paramedics truck drivers
my problem isn’t with the fajitas that’s fine eat up fatty
my problem is that you get the best and then you snivel and moan about sharing resources with people that sew up their own flesh wounds with thread at their dining room table
you’re like, oh no not my paycheck and i’m like who services your elevator you labor-dependent cream puff
adam you do not get it if the workweek was 35 hours they would give us 34
anything to avoid giving benefits
if the government didn’t require benefits they would just say screw it
if we want benefits we have to take them
you have this weird aspie inability to admit the government has ever had a positive influence on your life
its like the government killed your mom or something
Piznim -
Conversely, if the government didn’t have a cap on how many hours you could work, your employer may just give you more, thus boosting your paycheck. In addition, if the government didn’t take Social Security Taxes and Medicare Taxes, you would have even more money in your paycheck.
You said, “if we want benefits we have to take them.” I believe muggers, robbers, and rapists hold that philosophy as well. You are in good company.
Yeah, the fact that you think I am going strictly by Adobe page numbers only serves as proof that you have not even tried to read the bill. The pages are numbered in the text of the bill.
So, having not read it for yourself, you are depending on others to tell you what is and is not in the bill. Some will tell you the truth. Some will lie. But how will you know the difference unless you read it for yourself?
That is why I am working on reading the whole thing for myself. I want to know, for sure, if what I am hearing is fact of fiction. I want to be able to make an informed decision.
Here is the link to the bill (page numbers included)
http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/getdoc.cgi?dbname=111_cong_bills&docid=f:h3200ih.txt.pdf
I don’t actually want to get into this whole thread, because it’s kind of ugly and gross, but I hope “gioia” is still following the thread. This is for her and not anyone else who’s commented here.
This is a small detail, but I think it’s important: the public option, if it passes, would be one of the only ways that unmarried women and men, gay and lesbian domestic partners, and people in nontraditional relationships would be able to get benefits without having to win coverage through their partner’s employer. My employer currently gives benefits to long term same-sex partners, but all too many don’t. By being purchasable by individuals — so you could have one partner who worked and paid for two policies worth of public option insurance, and one partner who raises children/is a homemaker/doesn’t work for any reason but still gets insured — thousands of same-sex relationships and child-rearing relationships would become vastly more equitable and more fair.
Just food for thought.
I am sure that most people reading this understand the ugliness of piznim’s views – prejudging people on the basis of their (presumed) race and proclaiming his hatred for people he has never met.
But some may not realize that piznim’s views and those expressed by Thomas (the RTV staffer who started this post) are essentially the same. They both seek to devalue people with whom they disagree by an appeal to racist and age-ist arguments – they don’t look like us, so no reason to listen to their opinions.
Here’s a novel idea: try listening to the arguments of the people that oppose the current health bills. Ask yourself why the media and the Democratic backers of the bills are scared sh–less of the citizens showing up to voice their opinions, and why they constantly try to marginalize them and equate them the the “death panel” kooks. It is because most of them are intelligent, well informed, and (egads!) understand the economic ramifications of this huge entitlement program. Some of them have actually read the bill, which puts most congressmen at a distinct disadvantage. Democrats and their media allies are afraid of these people because they cannot control them with their usual generalizations, platitudes, and outright misrepresentations.
Whether you ultimately agree or disagree with the protesters, give them the respect of listening to their viewpoint. Don’t dismiss them out of hand as Thomas seems to suggest.
Regarding benefits: If the tax code and the government-imposed restrictions on out-of-state insurers were not so biased against individual health insurance plans (as opposed to group plans through work), people working less than full time would have the ability to purchase their own plans much cheaper.
As we become more of a freelance culture, more and more people are working multiple jobs instead of the classic 40-hour desk job. Young people are much more likely to fit this discription. Our current benefits system does us a real disservice by marrying benefits to full-time employment. Real health care reform would divorce insurance from the workplace. Businesses don’t want to be health plan administrators. They want to put their resources into making pet rocks or whatever. Stop tax-favoring workplace group plans over individual plans and the 20-something working 2 jobs with an internet business on the side would be able to buy his own portable coverage. Such a pro-entrepreneur policy would result in an explosion of small businesses. Contrast that with the tax penalties for businesses in the current proposal.
Allow cross-border competition so out of state insurers can undercut each other on premiums and expand their risk pools. Reform the broken medical malpractice system to drive down the spiraling costs of care (it is the actual costs of medical care that account for the exponential increase in heath care premiums, not the profits of insurance companies as Rock the Vote suggests on this website).
Empower individuals or expand the welfare state? It’s an easy choice for me.
“your rights? in Texas they executed an innocent black man this month. His name was Cameron Todd Willingham, look it up”
I did look it up.
First, he was not black. He was white. Here is a link to a picture of him in the Chicago Tribune. However, that makes absolutely no difference to me. Again, I state that RACE HAS NO RELEVANCE TO ME.
http://tinyurl.com/Cameron-Todd-Willingham
Next, I am 100% against the death penalty – for any reason. I do not believe we can EVER be 100% certain about a person’s guilt. If there is even a fraction of 1% question, then I do not believe the person should be executed. Locked up for life — yes! But executed – NEVER. If future developments, new evidence, or advances in science exhonorate a person in prison they can be released. Dead is permanent. I support any government reform that eliminates the death penalty.
Lastly, the death penalty has nothing to do with whether or not HR 3200 is right for America. Health care and how we can make health care and health insurance more affordable for everyone is the subject at hand. At least I thought it was.
—————–
“your rights? 11 million children are uninsured and I don’t see you lifting a goddamn finger, but then you wouldn’t because you don’t give a flying one about…”
For starters, your language is offensive.
I have demonstrated to you how the current government regulation (a violation of the Interstate Commerce Clause of the Constitution) prevents you and me from purchasing health care across state lines. If we were able to do so, insurers would be forced to compete for customers and that would drive down the price of coverage. Yes, the insurance companies are interested in profit. Their shareholders demand it. That is why they will lower their prices in the face of fierce competition for customers. They do not want to loose customers and will lower prices to keep them because some profit is better than no profit. It is government regulation that is preventing competition and driving prices up.
I have also demonstrated to you how current government regulation preventing groups of people from banding together to demand better pricing is an unconstitutional violation of the First Amendment. Labor unions, such as the UAW or the IBEW, or many others join workers together to demand better working conditions and better pay. Why can we, as health care consumers, not form a “Health Care Consumer’s Union” and demand better pricing by being allowed to purchase group policies?
These are both reforms for which I am fighting and, I sincerely believe, both will lower insurance costs and make insurance coverage more available to you, to me, and to the Hispanic child with hearing loss to whom you referred.
—————–
“your rights? we insure the people in this country who sit at desks and shuffle papers, and leave people with callouses and backaches and 39 hour workweeks out in the cold…”
Yes, I know exactly what working people have to endure. From the 60 years my grandfather worked a his farm just trying to make ends meet. To my father, a former UAW factory worker, who is now disabled and is just trying to survive. To my mother who spent 30 years working 60 hours a week in retail sales. I, personally, know what it is like to work when the temperature in the factory is 120 degrees. That is why I worked my butt off to get an education and have have dedicated myself to trying to make things better – for everyone.
I believe in less government interference. Government interference, as I demonstrated above, causes people to not get the best deal possible. Unions are a perfect example of how NON-GOVERNMENT organizations of people can band together to get better conditions. Not saying unions are perfect, they are not, but they are private enterprise at work.
“reforms for which I am fighting and, I sincerely believe, both will lower insurance costs and make insurance coverage more available to you, to me, and to the Hispanic child with hearing loss to whom you referred.”
more available is not available. you don’t care about available. your ideology about small-government and free markets trumps your care for people, because it only takes one generation of cushy, government-protected and people-enforced union benefits to give a guy this feeling that he’s ‘worked his butt off’. You didn’t. People in this country literally work themselves to the point where they can’t sit down or bend their knees. Your summer job or whatever in a hot factory, is whatever. I am abundantly sure you’re kicking back in an air conditioned office right now thinking, man, free-market capitalism is GREAT. if I didn’t have to share with brown people, i could get even more cool stuff.
See how far unions would’ve got without the US government protecting them. Private enterprise at work my ass. There are still companies out there unionbusting and forbidding legal association and illegally replacing union workers with undocumented laborers who have no rights and can be completely abused. ask adam. unions are not free competition. they made ayn rand sick to her stomach. if you didn’t have a government willing to beat down industry thugs, you’d have no union at all
the UAW you are so ecstatic about supports the public option.
And I still don’t see you lifting a goddamn finger. If you got your education to help people, why are you in here crapping all over the only significant health care reform in the last ten years? where’s the “J Plan?” What are you doing to make a change except whine about other people being racists and sniffle about your tin-hat libertarianism not getting a fair shake?
show me where you’re fighting for change identify its positive qualities point us to its location and let us join in.
because what you’re doing here sounds like hypocritical republican obstructionism. your ‘read the bill’ stuff is straight out of a town hall tantrum
you were right about the execution, though. I saw a black and white picture and thought that, like 50 percent of Americans on death row, he was an African-American. fact remains, you would not trade races with a non-white person for any reason. less money more danger less representation and then you’d have people on message boards being like ‘man I worked my butt off at cornell (all-nighters, dude!) to get this IT job so i could wreck the welfare system and turn you cats out but don’t disagree with me because that’s reverse racism!’
Piznim, you are wrong again. I would trade races with Bob Johnson, Kenneth Chenault, E. Stanley O’Neal, and John W. Thompson just to name a few. But again, this isn’t about race, even though you keep bringing up the topic for whatever reason.
In your own words, “if we want benefits we have to take them.” As I previously stated, I believe muggers, robbers, and rapists hold this philosophy as well.
adam that is the single dumbest most naive argument i have ever heard in my life you seriously have to get out on the town a little bit like see a movie or something
muggers robbers and rapists say “we want money, possessions and sex and so we take them”
nobody’s holding you up for health benefits punk. if they did, I’m pretty sure we’d have them already. instead, we voted fair and square for a liberal majority, got out on the streets, and big-money free industry bought themselves a roadblock with blood money
and if you wonder why I keep talking about race, ask yourself why you equate wealth-redistribution liberals with rapists. just think for a minute with your whole brain about your nice white paycheck and all those brown fingers trying to get a little piece. sound familiar? scare you? you’d prefer a world where we practice “me for mine”? unrestricted free market in a world where white people own the vast majority of usable capital? Convenient!! slavery? illegals in sweatshops? where in the world do you think your money comes from? no worries, just pray at the altar of the invisible hand, and if that causes a spike in infant death among the underclasses, then amen.
i think if we had members of the house who believed that aspies were all useless drains on public resources, and if insurance companies denied your claims for aspie aspirin, you’d switch parties in a second and you’d be all like that’s so unfair please I need the government to protect me
or maybe you’d just hit your communicator and beam right back up from where you came from
WoW!!! a lot of heated discussion going on on this subject. From the outside looking in, all parties discussing the subject of “health care reform” I would have to say have valid concerns. I would also say if we take the meat of the discussion (called talking points) and formulate what is actually pertaining to the subject matter (without all the bias and rhetoric of race) and craft together a piece that can be delivered up to the policy makers on all sides of the subject, we may just have something they don’t. While it is true we do need health care reform, I agree with someone who pointed out how badly a government run plan could run a muck (possibly spelled incorrectly).
The government is us people; “We the People”. Isn’t that how our constitution reads at the beginning? We have to take back our government and hold ourselves accountable for how badly things have become in our society. There’s something to be said for “old fashion” ways. There’s something to be proud of a little known thing called “tradition”. There is also something to be learned from all of the heated discussion here. I think we all care about what is happening in the here and now. I think (and this is only my opinion) we need to take the word “CARE” in “Health Care” and apply it here. Everyone in this country (born here or not) is entitled to world class medical care or attention if they need it. However, with that being said, I agree that there should be some sort of proof positive test that the person being treated is actually “entitled” to a U.S. discount or whatever or however it comes about in cost. Too much of the American tax payer dollars are wasted on those that don’t “CARE”(Constitutionally American Run Entitlements) about us “We the People”. I don’t have the answer to how this can be done, maybe one way is to patch them up, and if they’re illegal have their government pay for the bill or come pick them up on their dime; or reduce our deficit with that nation.
We are Americans, we can do anything, we are “World Class” citizens and yes some of us are even a–holes. But it’s because we live in such a great country that we are allowed to think outside the box and come up with great ideas and solutions.
Health Care Reform is not a color topic or an affluent topic. It’s about “Health”; and if you don’t have that you won’t have either because no one will be around to propagate either.
There has got to be a way to develop our Health Care reform derived from some of the ideas of those countries that do have Universal Health Care Coverage but making it American. That’s what America does. We take whats best from those that have come before us and make an American product and we’ll have “CARE”. But it is up to each of us to reach out to each other in a civil manner and stop getting off point and do what is right for each of us, our families and future generations in this country.
I don’t have any great quotes or statistics, all I have is common sense and an over whelming big heart to care about each of you in this discussion to believe that we all know something must be done; and unless we take back what is rightfully ours with civility and the burning desire to get America back on track with “We the People”, there won’t be an America in the future; at least not one that any of us will remember.
Thanks for hearing me out.